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Lease Only!!

Discussion in 'Plesk for Linux - 8.x and Older' started by sagelike, Feb 27, 2008.

  1. sagelike

    sagelike Guest

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    Do I understand this correctly?

    You can now only lease Plesk server products? I checked the store and I can only lease various products, even the flippin addons.

    I hope this isn't true but if that's the case, then I've made my last purchase of Plesk products. And I was looking at Plesk Expand.

    This is apparently what happens when you remove all the competition and feel like you own the marketplace.

    How does anyone else feel about this?
     
  2. alexmv7

    alexmv7 Guest

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    Nothing to wory about

    I'm not wory about this, becouse Plesk itself (disregarding of it's price) is a bunch of SWSOFT spamming and outdated free software with worst in the world support stuff. This was a very interesting software 2 years ago, but today it is dead.
     
  3. Hultenius

    Hultenius Guest

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    Whoah.. $69.99/month PLUS $24.99/month for Power Pack (SpamAssassin can not be bought separately anymore).

    Thats almost $100/month for ONE license.
    Or $1140/year if you want to put it that way.

    SWSoft/Parallels are serious about killing off Plesk.
     
  4. pdws

    pdws Guest

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    Well, Parallels still offer Plesk Plus bundle - Unlimited domains, all additional features and 1 yr Email support included as a perpetual (one time fee) license.

    They also do have a tade-in promo right now. It is possible to trade in any of your existing retail license, pay additional $699 and get a newly issued Plesk Plus one with 1 yr of SUS and Support.

    Promo announcement: http://www.parallels.com/en/buyonline/plesk/

    Rgs,
     
  5. faris

    faris Guest

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    Companies sometimes make bad decisions. This is one of them.

    The removal of owned 30/100/300 licences and add-ons will result in (hopefully) a massive drop in revenue rather than an increase in revenue for them.

    As a company you need to balance making money with putting people off and unfortunately this one tips the scales in the wrong direction.

    You should email your sales rep if you agree this is the wrong thing to do. Never underestimate the power of the people.
     
  6. ThePhantom@

    ThePhantom@ Guest

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    We are very surprised when we got an e-mail from our supplier telling us Parallels want us to charge for our licensee we already bought before.
    Onetime fee has the meaning you not need to pay again.
    If parallels will not change their mind we will be forced to get another control panel and they will lose a customer to their concurrent.
    Plesk already gave us a lot of headace and the only reason we still use it is that we already paid big money for it.
    I try to type very nice but in my head I hear the words very loud
    ARE THEY CRAZY!!!!
     
  7. onsightdata

    onsightdata Regular Pleskian

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    Ok , I have not got any email on what is going on. I have purchased unlimited domains and the power addons etc. I have paid my money for updates etc. What has all changed?
     
  8. pdws

    pdws Guest

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    For those who already have retail/one-time fee licenses actually NOTHING has changed. Those already purchased are still valid and will be. Just make sure you renew SUS on time. Licenses that are offered now are lease ones (except for Plesk Plus). That's it...
     
  9. faris

    faris Guest

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    Sedrin,

    I think the confusion over that is partly to blame for this thread not exploding - the subject of the thread is not really appropriate for the actual problem, which is the withdrawal of 10, 30 and 300 owned lisences - which IS a real problem.
     
  10. joeybutterface

    joeybutterface Guest

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    It's probably not really a serious problem for a lot of us.

    The product has already turned a lot of people off with all the in-built spam that is notoriously difficult to manage/hide. I have not exactly been enthusiastic about continuing to license more of our servers with Plesk. Now they have decided they don't want to sell us licenses anymore then I can only thank the company for making the final decision for me.

    We'll continue to renew our licenses until no more of our servers are running Plesk then goodbye for good. :)
     
  11. philjohn

    philjohn Guest

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    Exactly, we decided a while ago that relying on another company that has started using questionable practices was not a good thing from a business stand-point.

    We've actually started working on our own control panel to manage our servers after realising we use so little of the core plesk functionality (and had to use lots of manual work-arounds for broken parts anyway) that it would be the best way forward.

    At the end of the day, all Plesk does is offer a somewhat pretty front-end to a bunch of pre-configured free software; it's not rocket science. The only reason we used it instead of manually setting things up is that clients like an interface to control things like email accounts, and it makes it easier for the support staff to not break things when changing accounts. We don't actually sell hosting, we only host our own apps - so our usage is probably not typical.
     
  12. joeybutterface

    joeybutterface Guest

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    My use of Plesk is very similar to your own. We don't run a web hosting business per say. Although we do host projects and applications for partners and clients across a reasonably large number of Linux-based servers.

    My list of fixes to patch broken functionality has grown to three documents now. I have to run through the list every time we upgrade to a new version in the series.

    We don't really need Plesk. But it's been convenient to use to automate management of portions of our infrastructure.

    We have been working on our own software for many months already. We'll be turning up the heat on development now (it's been very casual until this point) so we can start migrating away from Plesk - now we wont be adding anymore Plesk servers.
     
  13. ladhani

    ladhani Guest

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    cubepanel as Plesk clone / alternative

    Hello,

    The idea of lease means that somebody else can block use of an application, for example, in case of some stupid troubles with payments etc...

    So we are looking at alternatives for simple 100 domain licenses that are unlimited in time (so can not be blocked due to stupid unforeseen thinks / Murphy's Law).

    Does anyone have experiences with the Plesk clone: Cube Panel.

    http://www.cubepanel.com/

    They offer free 5 domain licenses and euro 160 for 100 domain license.

    Say, more similiar to the old Plesk license model.

    Thx!
     
  14. nibb@

    nibb@ Guest

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    I also agree. We have provisioned or last Plesk server and new servers will come probably with LxAdmin which is very more powerfull then plesk, works in VPS and is very cheap.

    Plesk is built of free softwares that you can get for free and they charge you. They dont launch anything new with it since years. No only basic support for other mail softwares and stuff.

    Not only is Plesk heavy priced but very unpersonal, plesk spams in the control panlel, inside the clients account, and now even putting favicon inside every website.

    What will be next a
    Powered by Plesk on every site hosted with plesk?

    Not to mention we are talking about a paid panel here not a free one.

    We would be very stupid to lease plesk that is almost non brandable and comes with outdated ****.

    Cubepanel looks also interesting.

    Also you see the bunch of **** they launch with other softwares like Sitebuilder? I received the email and it has 2 Major features !!!!

    You can add SitePal and Buy Fotolia images. Wow what a big improvement. That must be someone from the NASA that adds affiliate programs and announces those as updates. No t to mention that Plesk gets all revenue from your clients !!!

    Yes that is right. They add fotolia in Plesk too and you cannot put your affiliate link in Sitebuilder. They get all revenue.

    Plesk has become the worst paid control panel in the industry. Go for LxAdmin or ISPConfig. They are free and rock in features. All plesk has is a nice interface. And im not willing to pay so much for it.

    Im deciding to dump plesk since 2 years but this just gave me the THANK YOU Paralles. No wonder my hosting business it not growing. If you have such **** like plesk running. Sitebuilder will also see a bye a bye, anyway Google has the same tools for FREE
     
  15. hostex

    hostex Guest

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    We use to buy our licenses and do the Plesk install but it's such a pain to install and the cost is so high (now higher) we lease most of our servers with Plesk from the data centers we use.

    Right now we can get CPanel/WHM Fantastico w/ RVSkins for $28/mo. for unlimited domains and Plesk w/ Power Pack Unlimited Domains for $35/mo. from LT. We have a few customers with leased 30/100/300 domain licenses.

    Does anyone know how will this affect those licenses?

    I totally agree with all the above posts! They need to get a grip.

    It's pretty crazy when the control panel costs as much as a low end server!!
     
  16. nibb@

    nibb@ Guest

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    I dont think licenses from datacenters will be affected since they buy thousands of licenses in millions. Parallels would not dare to raise prices to big hosting companies or datacenters since they actually decide what the market uses. They would just unplug the plug for plesk and millons of clients would stop using Plesk in a major draw back for the company. So no they will not raise prices to datacenters as far as i see it. Its simple, if they do people will not choose plesk anymore but Cpanel. Simple.

    Actually i think the removing of prices if just because most people dont buy directly from Parralles, they do it from datacenters and resellers where you can get the leased license cheaper. What Parrallels is trying to do is to make people lease licenses not to own them.

    Owning a license is just 1 big earning against leasing which is a recurring fee forever.

    This way people would not buy licenses but lease them. And most do lease via datacenters. I still think this not a nice move of Paralles.
    We wanted to buy 10x 100 domain licenses upfront so we could save a little instead of leasing.
    I now and most people will agree that most business don't want to lease things for a long period of time. It increases your cost and your final prices. That means if you have a heavy capital of $$$ to invest its actually pretty dumm to buy the licenses, its cheaper to lease them. his is the model Paralles wants to bring into the market. Software as a Service.
    But if they dont want people to buy directly anymore they should just remove the store and put a link to resellers or partners. Removing the options and force people to lease is not a smart move. I always read many magazines where the CEO of Parrallels puts all his bets to Software as a Service. So yes, they want people to pay each month instead of owning the licenses. I bet you that they will eventually remove the owned license and you will not be able to buy Plesk anymore but just to lease it.

    They do this on HSPcomplete for example. You cannot own it. The trick you to so you think you own, you get a license and all but then you have to pay a maintaince fee every month and that is just the same as leasing. People are not stupid anyway. A hosting company cannot lease all of their softwares, if they would then they would not earn anything. Even said all this.....

    I don't have a problem with this model if Plesk would rock and it would be so powerfull and full of features that people would beg you to sell them hosting with Plesk or people would only try to buy Plesk hostings. If this was true, then yes, most people would be still be happy to pay a big lease fee to plesk since, hey, its making you earn more money. Sadly this is not the real world. People still prefer Cpanel, Plesk is spammed everywhere, you have count how many times a link to swsoft.com and the name SW Soft appears on Plesk? Its everywhere. Also Plesk is horrible with support, you have to pay extra if you lease from a datacenter, not to mention that is doesnt bring anything new to the table. Most open source panels have the same features and most of paid panels have even more and better features then plesk. So this is what i blame plesk for. If they want to try to sell it as a service then they should give first class support for the money you pay, they should fix upgrades, fix bugs fast, and put new feautures that not a single panel has and the developing should be fast. Putting software as a service can work but not how they do it. If people pay each month money they expect something for it. Nobody wants to pay each month and dont see anything new, not be able to request support, use a panel full of spam, full of bugs (They still after 2 years did not fixed a MySQL database problem when you migrate sites from Plesk to Plesk panels, which plesk corrupts accents), not to hear your clients (2 years, this is the 3 year we dont see Postfix not ClamAV).
    So you would have to be crazy to pay each month for something that is old, buggy, take forever to implement new technology and is with spam everywhere of Sw Soft.

    This is just putting a pistol against your head, because you increase your costs for what? For something you can get for Free in other softwares. How can a free software be better then a lease panel that costs 69$ a month directly from Parrallels?

    I know exactly the problem Parrallels is experimenting. They have grown so fast and are so big that vanity claimed into their heads. They think Plesk is the 1 number panel, that people die for it, and no matter what people will use it, just like Microsoft. They have copied the mode exactly. Expect that Microsoft gives you tons of paid things for free in the OS they release and plesk just give you open source software and free things. Microsoft clones a software and its in the next release, SW Soft implents the free version, buggy and decides peopl have to pay extra for it. Microsoft releases new features with time, plesk cannot even put basic things like a good interface to the anti spam filter.
    Microsoft only makes you pay 1 time and then you have fixes and updates for free. Sw Soft makes you pay a leases license and then makes you pay for every addon, module or support extra. Microsoft is the OS that most people have into their computers, they only have Linux as competition, people that play games use Windows. Plesk is not the only one in the server world. They are hundreds of paid and free control panels. Most people hate Plesk because of the image they give with all their branding in the panel. Just talk in hosting forums, most people are cpanel lovers, most of my customers ask me to sell them cpanel and i only have plesk. So they are not the first panel in the industry. People want choices and Plesk is exactly the opposite. You are forced to their looks and their feautures, most thing you need to heavily mod the panel to make it work, so its terrible.

    If Plesk doesnt come with a very big improvement on Plesk 9 or the new release my company will drop Plesk for good. If the new versions are just stupid bug fixes and affiliated links and paid services i have to buy extra for each single server then they can forget me. Im so loyal to this company that doesnt give me anything back. I dont even offer services with products that are not from Plesk. I only did this because i started with Plesk when it was still from the german company which where 100 times better then Sw Soft. Most new releases are really a joke. They put a new release to fix 10 bugs and in the windows version you see 50 new features on every release.

    I remember someone said to me that maybe because plesk was so stable and it was so good that it did not needed any new features of releases. Juaz.

    You want to me to put a list? I could write 10 word pages of just basics things that plesk doesnt do and other panels do like letting you choose the order the server loads indexes. Like index.htm, index.php or even let you configure which one to use. That is so basic and it doesnt so. Hotlinking? Well Cpanel has that since ages. I know you can do most things but without plesk so whats the use for if i have to do eveything manually. Then i just good without plesk. Remote MySQL option.
    Postfix, ClamAv, etc, etc, etc.
     
  17. joeybutterface

    joeybutterface Guest

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    I'd say it's unlikely the company would alter the pricing dynamics for its largest data center customers. I'm sure they will still be able to license the software on similar terms as they do already. It would be a very dangerous game to play indeed if they tried hiking fees so significantly that existing models and client agreements would need to be changed with prices increased.
     
  18. joeybutterface

    joeybutterface Guest

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    nibb is right. Software as a service is all the rage in the industry. CEOs have been rubbing their hands gleefully at the prospects of raping customers of an ongoing monthly fee for the right to run the software with no ownership. It comes as no surprise to see Plesk now offered only on these terms.

    Time or tell whether this will work with a control panel that needs to be licensed across an ever-growing multitude of servers every month. I'm fairly sure companies will be looking for alternatives when they discover Parallels wants to rape their business of a high monthly fee, month-after-month, for the right to deploy Plesk as a hosting solution.

    It's certainly going to result in a significant increase in costs for every server you run over a period of time. When you start crunching those numbers, you'd have to be stupid to not evaluate alternative options in the marketplace.
     
  19. nibb@

    nibb@ Guest

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    Exactly. We have made numbers and using Plesk will just increase the final costs no matter what you do. And we get Parallels leases for a heavy discounted price, still theres no way t cut costs with Parallels. Plesk is very unusable just like it comes. To make it real usefull you have to buy almost all extra options, tha includes antivirus, several languages and other addons. Parallels charges for every single and extra feature. A complete Plesk server with all features costs at least 3 times as implementing other software. Not to mention Parallels makes their software highly unconfigurable inside the system so you have a very hard time to change from Plesk and are forced to use Parallels extras like Sitebuilder and Virtuozzo. Sure it will work with addons from other companies but they dont work well. You basically are tight to buy Parallels addons for life. Also I dont know how much times the Sw Soft name appears in the software, in Sitebuilder you cannot even remove it. And the Virtuozzo Spam that was the to much. We had to move from Plesk when they decided to rob our clients. I dont think its fear to brand more the Parallels names then my brand. Im the one that pays the server, hardware, bandwith and pay my staff to support every single client just to heavy market the Parallels name even more then me that i provide the service. Not to mention that i pay Parallels for this. So basically i pay them to steal my brand and force people to buy directly from Parallels, leave me cut off and to make the ? question marks on people heads on why i dont offer virtuozzo or other producst from Parallels. Hey if put so much branding inside my services they must be good. People just dont know im forced to it. Thinks have to changed in 2 years. And they will not change. This is the model Parallels is trying to approach.
    They will not succed and probably will go to the old model back once they see sales have dropped heavily. They even mentioned this before. They want to try to migrate each one of their clients to a Virtuozzo platform. This makes sense with the current prices. If you buy Virtuozzo accounts you get basically Plesk for free. They try to make people decide to use Virtuozzo that already is cheaper and comes with Plesk then putting plesk alone a server. The trick is that Virtuozzo is license on a per basis account so that means if you have 1000 clients you are sharing the profit of those 1000 clients with Parallels. Parallels implements his products not because they improve them or make them better, they decide its easier to erase competition. You all have seing how many control panels they have bought. Eventually they will let those panels die. And very fast. Instead of putting money on developing they have just put the money on buying out the competition.
    So dont expect Plesk to improve anytime soon.

    We are already moving servers away from Parallels and all that has to do with this company. Competition is eating us alive with prices and we cannot downgrade prices any further just because our costs are to expensive in software leasing. I recommend people to look for alternatives, even when Plesk makes major improvements they are always a step behind on tecnology. They are so slow that when something appears in Plesk its being a long time since the industry has adopted that feature. One of the reasons we choosed Plesk some years ago was because it was cheap and secure. This has all changed now. Its expensive and unsecure and so buggy to the point some things like Spamassasin just dont work. I hope someone reads this sometime. I still dont understand how management is done in this company, they must be real morons or have lack of understing completely on how the hosting world works. They have digged their own grave with this. I hope you all have a nice experience with Plesk. As for me it has being a nightmare for several years and im doing just what anyone smart enough would do. Drop this company.
    No wonder why several companies including number one hosting companies have their own control panel developed inhouse. You just have to have a bunch of servers to realize it would costs you less to pay a developing team them pay Parallels. And the CEO of Parallels wondered why companies like 1and1 still have their own custom software and there is allot of companies that still dont use Plesk. This guy must be an drug addict. Why would someone pay thousands of dollars to Parallels if they can develop their own things? Why would someone share for free a % of all your incomes? Its not like implementing Plesk is cheap, it will costs you less to pay programmers to develop things the way you want it. Imagine, you can get plesk complete for more or less 1200$. A company with 100 servers would donate to Parallels 120.000$. I dont know in what world they live but with 120.000$ i can pay another programmer company to develop a control panel that would be even better then Plesk. Not to mention the maintaince fee and all the addons you have to pay. No matter how you see it, stay on Parallels and you will share your profit always. They will try to get your money by any means. Im sure if they could they would charge you a fee for every time you access Plesk or even based on how much bandwith you consume, your bandwith that you pay !!!! If they could they would charge you for letting you change the colors or by hour you run the software in your servers. Software as a Service can work but not this way. Imagine the license servers from Parallels fails. You will be on the mercy of Parallels forever will everything you want to do in the server to the point it actually costs you more to remove this **** software then change to a new software. Im jumping of this boat now before its to late and im not coming back that is for sure.
     
  20. hostex

    hostex Guest

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    Thank you for all the input. I looked at cpanel and it's pretty much the same deal. $1499 for a license or $425 yr. for a lease which works out to about $35/mo. Then again it's unlimited domains. $29.99 per month for a Plesk 30 domain lease is steep. It's a slap in the face for small providers who try to compete with DC's that charge $10/mo for the same. In fact it's one of the reasons we stopped leasing servers from dell and put them in local co-lo space (we can not get Plesk licenses from them) and started leasing servers with Plesk from remote DC's. (we also get HW and reboots)

    The point above about Windows and updates being free make Windows sound like a bargain with you compare the long term cost to Plesk. (By no means am I a big fan for MS but we get many years of updates from them for free).

    I think the whole concept of add-on's at additional costs in the long run may have hurt Plesk software. If these where all included for free (including sitebuilder) it would have cut into the cpanel market and the cost for their SUS renewals still brought in monthly income and new features would make renewing the SUS worth the cost. Let's face it, if you have 10 servers collocated and need unlimited domain licenses @ $70 ea. that's $700/mo. How can a small company compete when large DC's that I would guess pay about $200/mo. for the same 10 licenses...

    Thanks again for all the input. Just my two cents. Wait, if I lease those two cents how much could I make?

    Don't worry, I know this thread would die if I had two lease my two cents so my input is free and includes free updates!
     
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